AwakenHer with Corissa Stepp
"AwakenHer" is your beacon of hope and strength, focusing on turning the pain of past relationships into the power of self-discovery and renewal.
Hosted by Corissa Stepp, this podcast serves as your guide through the complexities of healing and personal growth. Each episode unveils the stories of women who have triumphantly navigated their way through life's storms, alongside actionable advice from experts in the field. "AwakenHer" is not just a podcast; it's a movement towards self-love, resilience, and a joyful new beginning.
Join us on this transformative journey, and embrace the empowered woman you were always meant to be.
AwakenHer with Corissa Stepp
Navigating the Teenage Years: Cultivating a Respectful and Collaborative Parent-Child Relationship with Ann Coleman
When we're faced with the raging emotional storms of our teenagers, it can often feel as if we're navigating uncharted waters. Not true for our guest, Ann Coleman, who turned the tides of difficulty with her then-high school son into a journey of understanding and emotional connection. Drawing from her experiences and insights from the groundbreaking book "No Drama Discipline", Ann shares her journey from being a practicing attorney to becoming a parent educator and podcaster, helping many parents weather the tumultuous teen years.
We venture beyond the surface-level tantrums to explore the fascinating neurobiology of adolescence. Tune in as we unravel the mysteries of the teen brain, from the amygdala's role in irrational behavior to the quest for peer acceptance triggering dopamine. Understanding these not-so-obvious aspects of your child's brain is instrumental in effective parenting. We also address the significance of recognizing and supporting teen emotions, and how this can dramatically decrease conflict and build stronger relationships.
We round off our discussion with practical tips on teaching kids about independence and emotional regulation. Learn how reflecting on our thoughts and emotions can improve our responses to our children. Discover how co-regulation strategies can foster emotional well-being. And most importantly, learn how adopting a team mindset rather than an authoritarian approach can transform your relationship with your adolescent. This episode is not just about surviving the teen years, it's about thriving through them. Join us on this journey to transform the way you parent your teen.
Ways to connect with Ann:
Podcast: Speaking of Teens
Instagram: @neurogility
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Corissa is a Holistic Trauma-Informed Coach & Narcissistic Abuse Specialist™ who empowers women after they’ve endured narcissist trauma to rediscover who they are, reclaim their power, and find the clarity and courage to move forward and live a life they love. Corissa is also a recovering people-pleaser and codependent who has endured way too many narcissistic relationships to count! She coaches not only from her knowledge and training but also from the wisdom she has gained from her own healing journey.
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Podcast Website
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Book: The Savvy Girl's Guide to Thriving Beyond Narcissistic Abuse
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Welcome to the Stepping Into Meaningful Relationships podcast. I'm your host, carissa Stepp. I'm a relationship and human design coach, and this podcast is designed to help you create a stronger connection to yourself so you can transform the relationships around you, whether that be with your partner, a friend, a parent, a child or your business. We will be looking at relationships through the lens of human design, and my guests and I will bring you the tools, tips and tricks to create deeply meaningful connections with others. But first let's start with you. The most important relationship you have is the one with yourself. Thank you for tuning in. Now let's get to today's episode. Hey, everyone, welcome back to another episode.
Speaker 1:I am super excited to be chatting today with Anne Coleman.
Speaker 1:Anne Coleman went through a couple of really trying years with her son when he was in high school and decided to use her experience to help other parents.
Speaker 1:For the past four years, she's transitioned from a practicing attorney into becoming a parent educator and podcaster. She teaches parents of teens and tweens to build stronger relationships and decrease conflict with their kids so they can positively influence their behavior and mental health, and I am so excited to be having this conversation because I know that lots of you are also parents and we know that our children, as they get older and they approach adolescence and become teenagers, our relationships with them tend to change and it can be really hard to kind of reframe how our relationship looks and how we can connect with them in a more meaningful way. So, anne, thank you so much for coming on today. Thank you for having me. I love for you to first jump in and just share a little bit more about your background, about how you transitioned from being an attorney into becoming a parent, educator and podcaster Sure, and I'll make it kind of short.
Speaker 2:We did go. As you said, we went through a couple of really trying years with our son. We did not, we weren't prepared for it. He has ADHD and anxiety, had always had anxiety, and when he hit high school we changed schools and everything just kind of fell apart. He began smoking weed behind our back. We didn't know it for about a year. He said it was helping with his anxiety.
Speaker 2:That triggered me, because I had a brother who was a drug addict and he started out by smoking weed when he was about in the ninth grade actually. So as soon as I realized that every time I would, you know, see him and think he was high or assume he was high, or smelled like weed, that just blew up and so my emotions were all over the place and I began trying to control him. And what happened? There was exactly what we would expect. He tried to rebel, he did rebel and things just spiraled from there. It just got out of control. Where he ended up, actually, we put him in a residential treatment facility for mainly for his anxiety and at that point he had depression, but it was also for all the weed smoking which was also leading to other drugs. So we had him in residential. We're doing family therapy by zoom and the family therapist one day was trying to explain to me how to speak to my son, how to be acknowledging of his emotions and how to validate his emotions and how, to you know, be kind but firm. And I'm like, dude, what are you talking about? I have no idea what you're speaking of, foreign language and he just could not get it through to me. So he said, look, go buy the book no drama discipline, which is by Dan Siegel and Tina Payne Bryson. You may be very familiar Some some listeners may be familiar with this book. Dan Siegel is awesome. Tina Payne Bryson awesome. They write some fantastic books. Well, this was like opening a new world to me. I get goosebumps just talking about it.
Speaker 2:I started reading the book and I'm like, oh my god, oh my god. I mean I was on underlining and highlighting and post it notes. I've still got it's worn and ragged over here. But it explained to me what I did not know about our emotions and how our emotions impact our children's emotions and how we need to be able to sit with them in their emotion and validate their emotions and do all these things I had no clue about. I was completely emotionally unaware. I did not know that I was being triggered by these issues. Finally, when I read this book, I was like, oh my god, that's what's happening. I am overreacting, I am reacting to things that were in my background rather than being with my child in the moment this child and learning how to help him through this and trying to get through this myself.
Speaker 2:So that book was a real eye-opener and at that point I started changing things with my son. He came home from residential treatment. He was almost 18. He was just weeks away from turning 18. So we were kind of panicked because after that, you know, there's just not a lot you can do. So I started changing the way I reacted to him and that was a game changer. It changed everything. At first he was a little skeptical, I think, because he was like what are you?
Speaker 1:doing.
Speaker 2:This is weird. And then, as he got used to it, he started responding in a way that made sense and things started getting better, almost it wasn't overnight, but within weeks everything had changed and it was just incredible. And that's when I said you know what? I've got to tell this stuff to other parents. Other parents have got to understand this. I mean, I'm a pretty smart cookie and I had no idea what I was doing wrong and how I sent us down this rabbit hole actually, so I began studying and that's when I just thought you know what I've got to? I need to start a podcast, I need to put out all this information, I need to help people, and that's kind of how it started.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean that's a really powerful, powerful story. And you're right, I mean a lot of us don't really learn, first of all, like I feel like a lot of us didn't even learn how to acknowledge, process and feel our feelings, but then to have the self-awareness and the ability to have that pause and ability to reflect on why we're feeling what we're feeling, like what is going on at a deeper level, right, like, why are we being triggered? Like what's that pointing to? Is it pointing towards an experience that we had? Is it pointing towards a belief that we hold, a wound that we have? And it takes so much self-awareness to do that. But if you aren't aware, it's really hard to know. If you don't know what you don't know, and that's the thing I mean.
Speaker 2:If you've never been taught these things, it's not something that comes naturally for a lot of us, and I have a dhc and I have anxiety and have always had, and if you have those issues Then it is supremely hard to take a breath and stop and think and try to figure these things out, because everything in your life is just automatic. And so it was really hard. But the more I read, the more this, that book, no drama, discipline. It was the first time I've ever really been introduced to the idea of Emotion coaching and emotional intelligence I mean just emotion in general. So I was like god, this stuff is really fascinating. And he doesn't even really use those words.
Speaker 2:But as I started reading other things, I read doctor gotman, who he's? John gotman is no more, for you know couples, but he's also the guy that really kind of discovered the whole emotion coaching Thing and I can I'll explain that a minute. But he, I started reading his books and I'm like, oh my gosh, this makes so much sense that you know, you don't just jump in there and try to fix things and you don't jump in and give them advice and you don't, you know, tell them they're not feeling what they're feeling. Oh my god, this you know, it's just. It opens up a whole new world. So his book is let's see raising and emotionally intelligent child, and so that may have been the second or third book. And I read the goldman book about Emotional intelligence being more important than iq, quite probably. And so all of this sent me down. You know this, this for year, actually, journey of reading, study after study and article after article, and I, within that first year I was reading about the neurobiology, I'm of adolescence and that is what really is. So I opening and I think so many parents, a lot parents, do know some of the stuff but so many parents don't realize it. I'm in a lot of parenting groups on facebook and it. You know, it's amazing there, where I was, a lot of those women are exactly where I was four, five, six years ago and they just don't realize what's going on with their kid and it's very confusing. So I kind of put together a framework to help people, you know, get to this point where they are seeing what they need to see in their kids and they're able to support their kids and get past all this conflict.
Speaker 2:And one of the first thing, the first part of the framework is understanding how your child's brain works, and you know even kids that are younger than adolescence. It's really about the same thing adolescence, once puberty kicks in, there their brain starts doing all this rearranging and this reprogramming, and certain parts of the brain are much stronger than others and other parts are much weaker, so that their emotional regulation is way off there. Their amygdala is revved up and that's the part of the brain that you know controls the negative and some positive emotions. But so they are so easily triggered by anything, and it can be something completely benign and something neutral. And I got what did I say? And your kids, like you know you're having a peeling off the walls because he's going nuts over something you said that you didn't mean that, I didn't mean that, or there's saying these irrational things and and you know, my son was punching holes and walls and doors and just raging. Just that rage was coming out. And as parents you're like, oh my god, I've got to fix this, there's something wrong. There's something wrong.
Speaker 2:But if you realize that their brain is doing all this rearranging and that their their amygdala, the reward center also is hyper revved up, so not only are there negative emotions just on edge all the time and it's not their fault but they also Are easily, easily, I guess, triggered would be the word. But to enjoy pleasurable things. So their reward system. There's a lot of extra dopamine floating around in the adolescent brain and so all these things that are, you know, pleasurable or interesting they are much. They gravitate towards those things much more easily and they do risky things like smoke, weed and drive fast in cars and have unprotected sex and do these things because their brain is wired for them to do that. All this extra dopamine means all these things are so much more enticing and once they do them they are so much more pleasurable and rewarding and it gets reinforced in the brain, much more so than when they were children, or then they will be. Then it will be when their adults, because that dopamine starts to go back down, when the prefrontal cortex is finally Coming together in the mid, late, late could be 30 years old, but mid to late 20s at least. So they are really kind of like a revved up car with no breaks.
Speaker 2:I mean, they have, you know, all the stuff going on emotionally, everything going on with the reward system and the prefrontal cortex, the part of the brain that controls executive functions like being able to focus, being able to plan ahead, make good decisions, you self control. All of those things are weak because the prefrontal cortex, the synapses between the neurons in the brain, are still trying to strengthen and they're being pruned away. The things that you're not doing, that your kids not learning, those synapses are being pruned but the things they are doing and learning are being strengthened. So if your kids start smoking weed when they're 131415 years old, those synapses in the brain are going to be strengthened for smoking weed, meaning it's much harder to get them off of it, it's much easier for them to be addicted, to get addicted, and it's much more likely for them to be addicted later in life.
Speaker 2:That's why it is so important to try to keep our kids from trying these things as long as humanly possible, which is really hard these days, but and it's not impossible to get them to pull back on it, but it is so hard so that that prefrontal cortex, while these things, all these synapses, are strengthening and pruning, it's a lot easier for them to learn in school so they, even if they haven't been good in math in the past, they can actually become really good in math, and so it's important for them to know these things about their brain as well, because it's confusing two kids to go why am I so mad right now?
Speaker 2:Why did I, you know, do this? I don't, I don't get it. So it's important for our kids to understand these things, not just us, but that reward center also, kind of it has a pathway that connects with the amygdala and a couple of other brain centers and that I kind of call it the social center, and what this does is because of all this revved up, you know, emotion, and this revved up Reward center kind of all gets entertained, and so kids will act out and do crazy things when they're around their peers, because their peers and acceptance by their peers acts as a pleasurable Dopamine triggering a thing.
Speaker 1:So when it's also oxytocin to, because that recognition triggers oxytocin, just like love. What is well? So it feels really good.
Speaker 2:That's right. So they, they, you know, it's not so much that other kids are going do this, do this, do this. It's their brain telling them do this, do this, do this because it is more important At this age, especially in the early, early years of adolescence 131415 to be accepted is more important for them to be accepted than it is for them to feel like they have a family. At this point it it, these peers, become their family. That's why they don't pay attention to us anymore, that's why they're in their room, that's why they say barely three words to us, because we don't really count all that much right now. It's their friends that count, although they might not need that physical attachment to us as much. You know they can go out with their friends, they can do all these things, but they know they can come back to us and that we're there and that we will always love them. And that's why it's so important to not let this, you know, upset you and not let this hurt your feelings. It is perfectly natural.
Speaker 2:If this weren't happening and they weren't individuating and going out and leaving the nest, we might have a 35 year old living in our basement one day. So we don't want that. So we definitely want them, you know, doing what their brain is meant for them to do. But it is the reason why kids will do these crazy things. And, you know, we look at each other and go, oh my god, I mean, what were they thinking? Well, they weren't thinking. They don't have the ability to stop themselves and think. This is you know, this is the way the brain is supposed to be, so we have to get used to it and we have to know how to work with it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean I would say that, like that impulsivity, right, it's like that's where they are, it's like they're just very impulsive. And you know the other thing that I wanted to touch on that you mentioned, which is like they're almost seeking their peer approval as a way to get self validation right. So it's like, how do I learn to approve and accept of myself?
Speaker 1:it's like, well, if my peers approve and accepted me, then I can accept who I am exactly, and so I think, even just helping foster and cultivate within them A sense of safety, that it's okay for them to be who they are, no matter who that is, and that self-love and we can do that at a young age, I think that that would be highly beneficial, but of course it's hard when they don't really even know who they are, as they're trying to figure it out at this age and they're supposed to be exploring and experimenting and trying and testing the waters and that's what I was saying about attachment like right now.
Speaker 2:They're not as physically attached. You know, everybody says, oh my God, I miss my baby coming up and hugging me and I'm a snuggling on the sofa and they're not as snuggly and they're not as receptive to our hugs and kisses as they once were. But that does not mean that they don't still need that emotional attachment, and emotional attachment is what we have to remember and learn. Some of us have to learn how to give it, and part of that is this emotion coaching piece of it, which that's, in my opinion, the second part of this whole framework is learning how to coach our kids through their big emotions, and doing that is hard if you've never done it before. It does take some practice. But what it means is, rather than you know, your kid comes in and says, oh, I could just hear my child, you know he would start going oh and slamming things around and I could tell he was mad and I was like, do I say something? Do I not say something? But when that's going on, instead of jumping in there and saying you know, what can we do or how do we fix this? Or don't be so upset or calm down, it's not that big a deal. That's the exact opposite of what they need to hear, because to them, no matter what we say, it is a big deal and they're not going to accept from us that it's not a big deal. So what that does is it just makes them try harder and get more upset so they can convince us that it is a big deal. So rather than us invalidating their emotions in that way, we have to validate them and say, oh my gosh, okay, yeah, I get that. I see why you would be so.
Speaker 2:X, y, z, whatever the emotion is that you think they're feeling and that's another piece of it is trying to help them understand what they are feeling, because a lot of times they don't even know what it is. You know, they know they feel bad, but they don't know what bad they don't. Maybe they know they feel angry, but they don't know what specific kind of anger. Is it frustration? Is it annoyance? Is it rage, or is it that really I'm jealous or I'm embarrassed, I'm hurt or I'm hurt, and that anger is the outside. That's what's showing up on the outside.
Speaker 2:So, as parents, we have to acknowledge that they are feeling whatever they're feeling. We don't need to try to change it, we don't need to try to stop it, we don't certainly don't wanna dismiss it. We want to say gosh, I see how angry you are and I see why you would be angry. It's hurtful when someone does X, y, z, or it's frustrating when blah, blah, blah happens, and acknowledge that for them, because if you say otherwise, they're going to continue to be upset. They're gonna try to convince you that they do know how they're feeling, because they do know how they're feeling.
Speaker 1:So or they're gonna tell you, you just don't understand.
Speaker 2:Exactly, and I mean, if we've heard that once, we've heard it a million times and we don't understand, that's the thing we need to get straight in our own head. We don't understand. We're not living in their world. We need to try to empathize with them as much as humanly possible and try to understand what's going on in their world, in Teen World, because it is really different from adult world and it's really different from how Teen World was when we were teens. We didn't have the social media, we didn't have all the tech, we didn't have all this pressure to succeed and all these things that they are dealing with it's major. So that first part of it just acknowledging how they feel, listening, trying to give them some comfort like you mentioned, oxytocin if you'll put your hand on their back or hold their hand or give them a hug, if they're receptive to it, any of those little touches will bring that oxytocin about in their brain and it will help them calm down. Acknowledging their emotion helps them calm down and once they're a little calmer, then you can maybe have a discussion.
Speaker 2:But at this point, what a lot of us try to do is jump in there and start maybe correcting their behavior. Don't slam that door. Don't talk to me that way, don't do this. And let me tell you that doesn't work and it is only gonna make it worse. I mean, don't correct them in the middle of this. If they've come home after curfew and they know you're mad a lot of times, they're gonna get defensive right away and they're gonna be mad for both of you right up front. But instead of jumping in there and saying well, you were late for curfew, you know it's your fault. Why didn't you charge your phone? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You have to just get past that and know that you can talk about that later. Okay, they're an hour late. They're already mad because they know you're gonna be mad, so they're already upset about it. Maybe get through this first piece.
Speaker 1:let them get calm before you ever try to have a rational discussion, because there is no rationality to what they're going through right now and they can't think I would say like at that point what they are is they're in their limbic brain, which is what you were kind of describing before with the amygdala.
Speaker 1:I mean it's part of the limbic brain which is the emotional brain. It sits in the center of the brain and so it's really hard when we're in that emotional state to have any kind of reasoning capacity. We can't think logically, we can't have an open discussion right, we're just gonna get defensive, we're gonna just be reactive. And so helping them come back online which is kind of how I would phrase it is like getting them back online with their prefrontal cortex when they're calm and then having the conversation is better. But I love how you're outlying for parents here and outlining for them that it's important first to connect with them through empathy and validation, first Absolutely, and then that's gonna actually settle the emotions and then hopefully bring them back into feeling grounded and safe once they feel like you are trying to at least understand, even if you don't fully understand it, and I think that waiting until they are completely back online and come to have the conversation is gonna minimize the amount of conflict that you have.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I mean, that is to me. When I read this stuff, I was like, oh my God, I mean it makes so much sense when you know it. In retrospect, you look back and you go I mean I was doing all the wrong stuff. I was trying to fix it or trying to invalidate him, and so learning that bit of it. And then, when they are calm, then you can help them to problem solve.
Speaker 2:Instead of jumping in, though, and giving advice, which is what a lot of us try to do. Well, why don't you just do this? Or why don't you just say this? Or if you'll just start doing X, y and Z, things will be okay. No, no, no, no. That is not what they wanna hear. If they want our advice, they will ask us and they will say what do you think I should do?
Speaker 2:Now the younger ones. A lot of times, you may have to gently nudge a little bit and say well, what do you think we could do next time that might help this situation, or how can we brainstorm a little bit and see how we might do it differently next time? And you don't wanna use that patronizing voice, but how you talk to your own child, you know how to talk to your child and just try to figure it out. And if they say, well, I don't know, and what should I do, then you might give them little hints and let them try to figure it out themselves. And that's another big mistake we make, because when we jump in there and try to fix things for them, we are taking away one of the biggest opportunities for them to learn.
Speaker 2:If they are not doing this themselves and making their own mistakes and trying things and failing and learning from them, we are robbing them of the opportunity to grow. And let me tell you, by the time they're 18 and we haven't let any of that happen yet if they go off to college, they are going to fall apart. We see it all the time. I read studies about it all the time. Those kids don't know how to function because we've done everything for them. We've told them how to feel, we've fixed it, We've not let them make mistakes. So we are doing our children a disservice by trying to fix everything for them.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I completely agree, and I think what we're also doing in those moments is we're teaching them that it's not safe for them or that we don't trust that they can make good decisions for themselves, and so then they doubt themselves, they don't trust themselves and then when they do get to be adults, like you said, they don't know how to make good decisions for themselves because they're always relying on somebody else and we're basically just have created a codependent relationship with them where they feel like they need someone else to tell them what to do or they need someone else to fix it for them or someone else to rescue them, and we're just setting them up for a lot of unhealthy partnerships and relationships in their life going forward. So I love that you are addressing that and it's hard for parents, though.
Speaker 2:I mean it was extremely hard for me, especially when you have a child who is ADHD, has dyslexia, has, you know, dysgraphia, all these things, the school stuff. It is very hard to sit back and there is a line, you know, there with making mistakes, that you know you do have to jump in and help. But you know these, these social relationships that they have and things that they have going on at school, as much as we can allow them to figure things out for themselves, and a lot of times, if we just sit with them in these emotions, with them, and empathize and say you know, I hate that you're feeling this way. This is so hard and you know, maybe, maybe, if they're receptive to it. You know I dealt with this a little bit when I was younger, but sometimes they don't really care what we dealt with when we were younger because we, we still don't get it. But you know, I know how hard it can be for people to go through these things and you know, just sitting in, that a lot of times they will actually verbalize what they need to do next and they will figure it out on their own. My son, you know, he was 18 at that point. But you know it was amazing to sit there and see him figuring out these things on his own and learning how to, you know, tell himself I don't need to do this or this is unhealthy, and you know it's an amazing thing to see. But you know that that piece of that emotion coaching piece is not going to work if we don't have our own emotions in check. So you know that's another piece of it is we've got to have our own emotions in check and we need to really do some introspection and we need to learn about, you know, our emotions and where they're coming from.
Speaker 2:And one of the best things we can do is to journal and I know it sounds simplistic, but scientifically it has been proven over and over and over.
Speaker 2:If we will journal our emotions and write down what we're feeling.
Speaker 2:And if we've had a big, you know, blow up with our kid, write down what you were feeling in that moment, what, maybe, what thoughts were coming into your head. And a lot of times we don't even know what those thoughts are, but if we reflect on it afterwards, we can see what those thoughts were and our thoughts trigger our emotions. Our emotions trigger our behavior and and our physical feelings and our body all these things work together to bring about these. You know emotions and the way we react to our child and if we can understand what we're feeling, reflect on that. Once we get aware like that and we have that awareness of what's going on in our brain, it automatically helps us to regulate those emotions, because you can't be unaware anymore, you know what's going on and once you know what's going on, you're able to take that breath, you're able to see that space in between emotion and reaction and you're better able to actually think and respond to your child the way you should, rather than just going, which is what I always did.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, no, totally, and I love this because I do a lot of nervous system regulation work with my clients, and that's exactly what you're talking about, right, like our nervous system, the, the, the neurotransmitters are like emitting emotions, like that's what's kind of happening in our body, and so when we get triggered, our nervous system is reacting, and so we have to find that pause, we have to expand our flexibility and our nervous system and the gap between the trigger and how we respond, because, if we're so used to being on edge all the time which, let's face it, we live in a society that is high stress, always going, always on the move. There's no slowing down. You know you don't slow down and it can be slow down. You're not going to be successful, productive, whatever we're conditioned to just never take a pause or take a breath. And so it's so hard to increase that flexibility in our nervous system when we're constantly in a stress state.
Speaker 2:Yes.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:It's, it's, so, it's. You know we don't pause enough to actually think about that. But yeah, our, our, our limbic brain, as you said, all the that center, that emotional center, does not realize that our society has evolved beyond living in the wilds, with all the dangers of the animals and, you know, warring factions between you, know, people. Our brain still thinks that all that's going on and so it reacts to all those things, everything around us, that way, and so we do. We can find ourselves in a constant state of fight or flight, which brings on, you know, anxiety disorders, which is what I have. And so you have to be very, very consciously aware of that stuff. And being aware of what's going on in your body is such a big part of that. I had no idea, I mean, I can remember when I first started practicing a whole. I will never forget the first day I ever had to go to court. I was literally in the bathroom right outside the courtroom for 30 minutes with I'm not even going to say it was all. It was horrible it was. I was so sick and it was my body reacting to that that, you know, our, our, my nervous system was reacting to what my amygdala was telling me and my amygdala was saying get the hell out of there, it's dangerous, that is frightening, and. But I didn't know, I didn't realize what was going on and for years that you know that would happen to me and I'd get all these feelings. And then you know, when it was all these years later that I realized, oh my God, that's my body telling me that there's danger and that I'm anxious and I have to somehow figure out how to tell my body that I'm not, that there actually is no danger. It's just a room with a dude sitting on a bench in a black, stupid little rayon coat, that's it. So chill the heck down. And you know learning how to regulate our bodies like that. Then you know, our minds follow, our behavior follows and the biggest piece of that, you know, the journaling is huge.
Speaker 2:If you take it a step further and you you get into mindful meditation and mindfulness, then that it's an amazing thing. And I, you know I'm not big into woo-woo stuff, but I mean and? But now I realize mindfulness is not woo-woo and meditation is not woo-woo, it is science. It is science, baby, and the brain gets it. So I always recommend people, you know, download those meditation apps learn you can do it a minute at a time, just concentrating on your breath, and it helps you understand where that that pause is and how you can pause. And I would have never thought that I could have done it, but it's.
Speaker 2:It's transformative when you learn how to to concentrate on one thing at a time and be present at with one thing on your mind. And it helps with your kids because you're present in the moment with that child, with what's going on, rather than thinking oh my God, they're never going to get a job if they can't learn how to be on time. Or oh my God, he's such a slob and what's that going to mean in the future? He's not going to be able to find a wife or keep a job, blah, blah, blah. Or you're going back in the past oh my God, he's going to be just like my brother. Oh my God he's, he's going to be a drug addict. And you've got to learn how to live in that moment with your child, without thinking about the past, without projecting into the future, and mindfulness helps so much with that, to learn how to do that, I think.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think the other part is, sometimes we can blame ourselves, right In those moments like, oh my God, I failed him as a parent because I don't know how to handle the situation, or I didn't teach him how to, you know, regulate his emotions. It's my fault, you know, like we can very easily blame ourselves as well. And so I think, like you know, one of the missing pieces here not missing pieces, but like what you're already talking about which is we as parents, can co-regulate our children's nervous systems. And that's what's happening in these situations when you're staying calm, when you're connecting with empathy, you're staying grounded and you know how to keep yourself in that ventral vehicle state, which is the safe and grounded and connected space. Your child is going to learn to mirror that and their nervous system is going to just down, regulate to from that fight or flight that they're in.
Speaker 1:Now you know, something else that I wanted to mention that you were talking about is we can't Think our way out of a trigger right in the way, in the in the moment, right.
Speaker 1:So what I like to teach clients is ways in which they can like tools that they can use in those moments, because when you're sitting there and you're having a panic attack like that, you can't sit there and rationally say to yourself no, I'm fine, no, I'm fine, no, I'm fine.
Speaker 1:And then all of a sudden you're fine because your body is reacting to a perceived threat that your mind is not even aware of. So it's very hard to talk yourself kind of out of it. You know, in those moments I would say, splashing cold water on your face and especially focusing on that area under your eyes is really important because that aligns with your stomach Meridian, actually, and if we think about the vagus nerve, it runs from the middle of the brain all the way down to the gut Right. That's the mind gut connection. And so what you're doing is you're stimulating that stomach Meridian, your gut, that connection to the vagal nerve. You're toning it by splashing that cold water on your face and it's gonna help you ground, it's gonna literally take you out of that Anxiety. I mean a panic attack is a long situation.
Speaker 1:I understand that's a very serious thing.
Speaker 1:But I'm saying, even if you're feeling really anxious, right, and you're because you're being triggered, that's gonna help walking and moving your body. If we think about an animal that's under attack, right, that fight or flight, there's a, there's a mobilization of energy and that's why they either want to fight or they want to run, and your body is gonna do the same thing. So that anxiety builds when you are literally like it's like lightning trapped in a bottle and you're not moving your body to expel that energy. You have to move your body. So, whether that's shaking your hands, going for a walk, getting outside and getting fresh air, that's another good kind of tool that.
Speaker 2:I'd like to share with people.
Speaker 1:Yeah and teach your children that, yes, to Help them become aware of their triggers, their nervous system and how to move through it, so that they can feel safe when you're not there with them, because I can guarantee you their friends probably don't know how to. Regulate right how to regulate their nervous systems, and I'm guarantee you that a lot of educators do not know that they are, you know, not responsible, but you know they don't know how to regulate their own nervous system, so they can't Effectively co-regulate.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a scary thing. I mean, I will say my son, now he's 22, he, he does still have anxiety. I think people, you know, anxiety is something that Maybe it doesn't go away but, like you said, you learn to deal with it. You, you, you know develop tools and ways to handle it. He still has panic attacks and Every now and then. But he lives in Colorado, I live in Alabama.
Speaker 2:He will literally call me on the phone in the middle of a panic attack and I have to help him and I can't tell you how Hard it is for me not to go into a full-blown Panic attack myself when I know my son is states away and he's having a panic attack and I'm trying to help him through it. And you know, when he was little, I would, I would tell him, you know, hold my hands and we do square breathing and we, you know, because he was always anxious and I always knew he was anxious and and not even understanding mindfulness or meditation, way back then when he was little, I would still like talk him through steps to go to sleep. Like you know, relax your toes and relax your legs. You're falling into the bed. You know. We did all these things without really knowing what they were. But you know you're, you're so right, the you know this co regulation or co-diss regulation, because when you get upset, when they're upset, that just keeps them upset. So if you can show them that it's okay, if things are calm, mom's calm, and you know we're gonna get through this, that helps so much.
Speaker 2:It's kind of like, you know, when I don't like to fly, when I'm on an airplane, if I see, you know, something bumps or bounces, or if I hear something, I start to panic. What I do is I look at the, the flight attendants, and I think, okay, if, if they're not panicked, then I'm not gonna be panicked. If they're steady, then I'm steady, and now if I see them looking weird, I'm gonna freak out. But it's the same thing with our kids. They look to us to see. You know, should I be this way? Should I not be the subcon? Unconsciously, maybe Subconsciously, they need to see that. No, you're okay, things are all right, mom's okay, we're gonna get through this. And I mean that's just a big, huge part of it.
Speaker 1:I think that that also then Creates this dynamic in the relationship where they know you're the safe parent they can go to when they're in crisis or when they're struggling with something, and it just opens up the lines of communication which, as we know, when your kids or teenagers, their problems are much bigger than when they are Smaller and you want them to feel safe enough coming to you Instead of resorting to their friends and going to their friends for help with certain big situations.
Speaker 2:And that's, you know, the the biggest way that we have to influence our adolescence is by Allowing them to be heard and to make sure that they know that we're going to listen to them and that we're not going to Attack them or disparage them or or punish them or be angry with them when they tell us something that we need them to tell us.
Speaker 2:You know, a lot of us will say you can tell us anything, you can tell us anything. Well then, the first time that we find out that they've done something, or they admit that they've done something, what do we do? We punish them. That's it. They're not telling us anything else anymore. You've lost all of your influence with your kid. So, instead of that, what you have to do is you have to realize that it's At this age you can't just pick them up and put them in the car seat anymore. You can't just pick them up and say no, you're going to bed, it's time for bed. There, all the telling is over, that is done with. There is no more. You are going to do this, you are going to do that.
Speaker 2:And parents who are authoritarian that way or can't give up their manager position that they had when their kids were little and step back and take on more of a team Mindset, then it's gonna be hard. It's gonna be hard for the next 10 years with that kid, because telling them you're done and it you know. Whether you think that's right, wrong or unfair, what it doesn't matter because it's just a fact and it is the way adolescents are and because the brain is telling them they're not a kid anymore. They're not a kid. Their brain is saying, hey, you're grown up, you're an adult now. You know adult things, you know how to do adult things. You look kind of like an adult I mean, they're not, obviously, but they think that and thinking that is enough for them to want to be treated that way. So when they get to this point, we have to treat them with the same respect and the same difference that we would another adult. We can't be telling them go get to the bed or, you know, turn that game off. Not. Everything now, whether you like it or not, is a negotiation and it's a discussion and it's an open discussion and it is different from when they were young.
Speaker 2:And that is one of the biggest parts of keeping your connection with your child is supporting their autonomy in this way, and that's what this is. You are telling them I know you're an autonomous human being and I know you feel like you're an adult and don't say that out loud, but you know you're acknowledging that they feel differently now. You're acknowledging they're not a child anymore and that you have a, a team effort going on here, that you are sitting beside them in this and that you're going to help them through these next few years. You're not going to push them down this way or down that way, but you're gonna be there to guide them. So your whole role now is to step back and be that guide, rather than that authoritarian or that manager. And if you've always been an authoritarian where it's my way or the highway then you better change that attitude right now, because it does not work.
Speaker 2:People, I did it, I tried it and I had all these moms around me saying you gotta put your foot down. You got tough love do this, and I listened like an idiot and it just made things worse. So now that I've done all the research and all the studying, I'm here to tell you that doesn't work. You have to understand how their brain works. You have to understand that they have a need to be heard and be seen and be validated and acknowledged and respected. And there are some parents of said this to their like respect. When they show me respect, all show them respect. Well, okay, let's be adults here. That's not how it works. Where the adult they sometimes don't show respect because they are, they are emoting their emotional or you know, they're in that fight or flight mode and they don't always act respectful. But that can be addressed later again. You don't stop them in the middle of a tirade and say don't talk to me that way or don't disrespect me. That's gonna make things worse.
Speaker 2:After it's all said and done, you can have that little conversation and it's better to say something like you know, really kind of hurt my feelings when you said that, or I'd really rather you didn't talk to me that way, but I'm. But let me tell you this they're not talking to other adults that way. They are not. You know, if you're worried that if my kid disrespect me they're gonna disrespect everybody else, I'm telling you right now that's not happening. You are their safe space. So the fact that they do that means that they feel safe with you. Number one and number two do you think they're going out and talking to their teachers that way or other. You know it, trust me, you know it. If they were. So, autonomy support is the main thing.
Speaker 2:So in discipline and when you're trying to discipline your kid, that the whole thing now becomes a discussion, you don't tell them this is the rule. You discuss with them what the rule should be. What do you think? You know? What do you think the time should be that you need to be home on school nights? Well, I think you know Midnight, okay. And then you come back and you tell them you know, here are my concerns about that. You know, I don't know that you could get up on time, or I don't think you get enough rest, and blah, blah, blah. And then let's okay, so let's brainstorm. How can we kind of meet in the middle, or what if we do on the weekends? We do this and you know.
Speaker 2:So you start brainstorming, you start the discussion. You don't tell your child these are the rules. Everything is a discussion and things are to be negotiated. You know, if you have a hard and set, have a hard and fast rule, it doesn't mean that that always has to be the case. There are always exceptions to the rule and being, you know, a hardliner and saying well, no, you still have to go to bed, even though your cousins are visiting from out of town and you never see them, you know, but once a year that's not necessary.
Speaker 2:So learning how to be Flexible and learning how to negotiate and learning how to discuss those are huge during this, the stage of the game, and being able to do all that gives you that connection with your child, which means they are going to feel safe with you. They are going to feel like they can talk to you because they know you're not gonna Jump to conclusions or punish them or do any of these crazy things. When that's the one last thing I'll say. You know consequences, that's fine, but if they're natural consequences, you let those happen first and only if they have been given consequences at school. They got in trouble at school. That's all that you need. You don't pile on top of it at home, and everything doesn't need consequences. Every misbehavior doesn't need consequences.
Speaker 2:The whole point to adolescence is we're teaching them how to be an adult, and teaching sometimes means discussing with them how they might try something different next time and how we can work around this issue if they're not getting home on time is it because their phone ran out of battery? Well, maybe they need to take an extra battery with them, or maybe we need to decide that the rule needs to be that the phones on 100% before they ever leave the house. To begin with, you know there are ways to work around these things. It is not always Necessary to issue a consequence. If you're doing that, it's becoming more of a punishment and you don't want to go there. When consequences aren't logical, it's a punishment.
Speaker 2:Phone is not up for grabs unless they do something that has something to do with those things. It's not something to do with the phone and I see this all the time because people say I will take the thing. That means you know it means the most to them and it's going to hurt the worst. Your consequences are not about hurting. Consequences are about teaching. If they, if they, bullied somebody with their phone, they can take the phone, or, and and only the max, that any adolescent should have to deal with the consequences a week, it doesn't matter what they did.
Speaker 2:One week to an adolescent is for ever and you go past that and they're going to forget why they're, even you know, doing this. They're going to give up and they're going to say, well, to heck with it, I'm just going to do what I want. I'm just going to get punished every five days, you know. So just think about these things. Think about how you would want to be treated, to think about how you can preserve that relationship. I know some people say I don't care if they hate me right now, I'm trying to keep them. Well, guess what? You're not going to be able to keep them safe if they hate you, because they're going to do the exact opposite of what you would want them to do. They're going to do the exact opposite of what you value and what you've always taught them. The only way to keep them safe as an adolescent is to keep that connection, because that's what keeps the influence that you have with them. That's it.
Speaker 1:Oh my gosh, that was amazing. I feel like we need to end on that note, because I don't know that there's much, anything more than that. That was such good advice. I know that I learned a lot. I'm sure that the listeners learned a lot. Thank you so much for sharing your resilience and your wisdom and your years of research and studying and experiencing all of this, you know, with your son. So thank you, like from the bottom of my heart, thank you, and I feel like so many people are going to have a much more, a much improved and deeper connection with their children after listening and taking your advice. So thank you.
Speaker 2:I sure hope so. That is, that's my whole goal. You are quite welcome. Thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 1:So, and if people want to reach out to you, how can they get in touch with you?
Speaker 2:Well, I have a podcast it's called speaking of teens and you can get. You can listen on any app, but you can also go to speakingofteenscom to find the podcast and that's also on my website where I have tons of free parenting guides and we have a Facebook group, speaking of teens Facebook group. So if you will just listen to the podcast, you will learn all kinds of wisdom and we have all kinds of things that that will just bolster that wisdom and our little guides.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much. I know I'll be joining the Facebook group and definitely checking out the guides. Thank you again so much. You're welcome. We're going to include all of that. Yeah, we're going to include all of it in the show notes to so listeners, if you happen to be driving, don't worry, you can access it in the show notes so that you can connect with and directly and get some of these amazing and fabulous resources from her. Thank you again, everyone. Until next week, be well. If you're hearing this message, that means you've listened all the way to the end, and for that I am truly grateful. If you enjoyed this episode and found it valuable, would you mind leaving us a review wherever you listen to podcasts and sharing it with others? If you'd like to connect with me for one on one coaching or human design reading, you can find me on my website or on social media. Also, if you have a topic you'd like me to discuss on a future episode, please DM me. Be sure to tune in next week for another episode of stepping into meaningful relationships.
